Adult Swim....

[cartoonchaos]

What the heck is wrong with Adult Swim? No, seriously, I’m asking. I remember the days when AS was THE programming to watch. The cartoons were funny. It never really had the quality animation, but the writing made up for it. I remember when I LIKED Harvey Birdman. Now, they’ve abandoned the writing too. How can 12 oz. Mouse and Squidbillies even make it on the air? The positive side, I guess, is that there’s an opportunity for a creator to get their series on the air, and a lot of my old friends and classmates are now working on Adult Swim shows… but am I wrong to ask for a bar to be set? I mean… they are one of the leaders in creating and airing adult animation, they should set the gold standard. ESPECIALLY if they’re the home of great shows like Family Guy, American Dad and Futurama. ESPECIALLY when there are flash animated properties out there that are GREAT that they can air! Don’t believe me? Okay… how about these examples…



Happy Tree Friends – Have you seen this show? An old classmate of mine worked on it long ago. Imagine the Care Bears… now mix it with a ton of wild cartoon violence and blood. It is clever and shocking, and it’s already airing on some video game channel somewhere. I’m sure Mondo Media would work it out so it can air on CN.



Mr. Wong – One of the funniest shows from Icebox.com. Politically incorrect, funny and at least it’s animated a little better than 12 oz. Mouse.



Undercover Brother – Not sure if it could be done, but it started out as a Flash cartoon. I’m sure it could be made into a series. It would be a great companion to Boondocks.



I’m not saying they should use these, or even if they can, but…. See what I mean? They can do better. So why aren’t they? It’s hard for me to believe that their current programming is the best that the industry has to offer… or is that even what they are doing anymore?

[blinkmetoys]

Adult Swim is kind of awkward.

Their programming is really weird. A lot of their original programs are pretty bad. Squidbillies, sealab....etc....etc...

Futurama is an awesome show so its nice to see it on....except they play the same episodes over and over again.

Basically to be on Adult swim you either have to be Anime, Made by Seth McFarlen, or 15 minutes of complete stupidity. (some of which does work)

[Harvey Human]

I only watch maybe four shows on all of Cartoon Network and I waste little energy complaining about the shows I don't watch. I'm just grateful that there's something on there I like, since 99% of the shows on the other networks are awful.

I don't agree that your three ideas would make good shows unless they radically overhauled them.
Happy Tree Friends is just cute animals getting mutilated; i.e., the same ironic joke over and over.
Mr. Wong is amusing but not very funny, and the characters are all pretty annoying.
Undercover Brother is a funny movie, but would make a terrible cartoon show. I think we'd have something of about the same quality as Stripperella or the Ghostbusters cartoon.

It just goes to show you: People have different tastes, and if CN only made shows that cartoonchaos liked, few people would watch it.

You should probably just watch the shows you like and move on.

[cartoonchaos]

Harvey Human is right that there is a lack of good programming on television, and it does come down to personal taste. I usually don’t like reality shows, but I do like The Apprentice. I saw a few of you cringe at that. Personal taste.



I guess I just want to express my opinion that there should be a standard, you know? I look at shows like 12 oz. Mouse and Squidbillies… They make me think that it must be really easy to sell a show to AS. They make me think that just about anything passes as funny in those story meetings. They make me feel that everyone that really cares about production values must be in the movie industry… the same way that all the intelligent people in the world AREN’T in politics.



Am I wrong to feel frustrated about that? Or should I just kick back like Harvey and thank God that at least a few shows “got it right” and be thankful that Cartoon Network and Adult Swim even exist? Should I be a voice for “quality over quantity”, or should I be grateful that these animators have jobs?



Oh, and I think I have good taste, just the same as everyone else thinks they have good taste. I like Family Guy and a lot of people watch that. I don’t like Drawn Together, but a lot of people watch that too. There’s nothing anyone can do about people’s personal tastes, but can’t we do something about production values?

[madmanmarco]

GOD!...are you kidding me, Happy Tree Friends is awful.Why substitute one bad show with another? I thought your point was about writting?Happy Tree Friends?Writting?
Anyway, its hard to get "good" shows on any network that has one goal, the bottom line. Im not complaining, this is America, they can put on anything they want and what they want is demographics. Harvey Human is right on if you read the thread about the Teen Titans...BUY,BUY,BUY!
Why does everyone think they are entitled to "good" programing?
Go on public television! Be gorilla!But dont complain.

[Animated Ape]

Originally Posted by cartoonchaos

but can’t we do something about production values?

Since when has Adult Swim ever been about production values? Actually I take that back. They have always been about production values. They put the cheapest shows they can get or make to put on the air. They don't want to spend a bunch of money on a new show, because if it tanks then, well, they didn't spend a bunch of money on it. If it does well, well then they can make a killing off the show since it cost nothing to produce.

If you want quality shows, watch and support the quality shows. I don't watch very many shows now a days. Not since my lifes been taken over by poker Besides I'm just waiting for a new season of Venture Bros. Brock Rulez!!!

Aloha,
the Ape

[cartoonchaos]

Wow, I just used those as examples, and it goes back to personal taste. I'm sorry but if you take Happy Tree Friends and 12 oz. Mouse and put them both on a scale....

My point isn't just about writing, I guess. My point is more about what Harvey Human and Animated Ape is talking about. I want to know where the line between animation being art and a product begins and ends. Is it just a product now? I know that's what it's always been, but is that it? If someone just went and said that animation is definitively a product and nothing else, then I would at least feel better, so someone just go and yell "PRODUCT" really really loud. Then I can go and get a hairnet and some rubber gloves and be a content assembly line worker like everyone else.

Also, I'm just ranting and raving. I'm not complaining, I just see the way that television animation is going and it just bothers me. You guys are my free therapy, so thanks for being my couch.

Originally Posted by Animated Ape

I don't watch very many shows now a days. Not since my lifes been taken over by poker

Aw, you too? You know, I would love to go on that World Poker Tour thing. Even if I was the FIRST one to lose, it would still be a blast just to be there.

Cheers.

[sajdera]

I think it's one of the biggest ironies of today's American society that the late-night block on Cartoon Network is called "Adult Swim." In what way is Adult Swim programmed for the sensibilities of "adults?"

Almost anything on TV that begin with "Contains Mature Subject Matter" is gaurenteed to be devoid of any actual mature subject matter. I have no tolerance for this grab-ass-retarded-frat-boy bullshit and that's all you're gonna get at Adult Swim.

A real "Adult Swim" existed at one time. It was called "MTV Oddities" (I tend, though, to think of Aeon Flux as a part of that, too, but it wasn't). It featured great stories and art and gave your brain something to chew on. Aqua Teen Hunger Force and the like instead chew on your brain.

But I should also say that I have a general disdain for terms like "adult animation" or "kid stuff". It's based on this widespread notion that kids as a whole can't handle this or that. I remember an interview with Matt Stone (or Parker) where he was saying the "innocence of children" is a bunch of bullshit. Kids can be cunning, dastardly and cruel little assholes. The whole kiddie vs. supposed-adult-we-still-can't-cuss-on-TV crap is old.

I saw an Aqua Teen Hunger Force DVD set at BestBuy and I was thinking, "who the hell would ever BUY this shit." It's unbelievable.

[Harvey Human]

Originally Posted by cartoonchaos

Should I be a voice for “quality over quantity”?

There's no point really. If you walk into a party and say "I hate this" and "I hate that," what have you really accomplished?
Do you think that suddenly people will start hating their formerly-beloved shows, food, or whatever? Probably not, unless they're complete sheep. All you'll accomplish is pissing people off.

If a show is bad enough, the marketplace will take care of it, and it'll be off the air shortly. I don't expect that Squidbillies or 12 Oz. Mouse will be on the air for long, unless they upgrade the concepts in a hurry. They're both just completely ugly to look at whereas I can at least look at a drawing of a delicious shake and fries.

[madmanmarco]

Hey Chaos, sorry...I didnt mean to come off like an a@$hole! It's just that im an a@$hole. Medium is medium, its all there to sell something. You could kill your television (im so punk rock) or worship your productvision. I am going with the later. I mean you could go to the met and see a bunch of work in frames on a wall that is considered high art...but dont you think Chuck Close wants to sell his work too? He hasnt painted anything but enormous heads since the seventies because it sells. I understand your idealogical quams with commercialism vs. art or....i dont mean to make this complicated....but the only thing that is important is the art making process, it defines you to yourself and thats it, because when you put it out there the functionality of it doesnt belong to you any longer, it belongs to me...and everyone else hooked to the tube (we dont know how to play poker).